Aristotle, Plato and their Commentators

Also in Volume 1, book 2, page 267 of the above, we read: ..."such as to fabricate the heavens, inclosing them in a convex figure; to establish the numerous multitude of inerratic stars; to give subsistence to the heptad of planetary animals; and to place earth in the middle, but water in the bosoms of the earth, and air above these.

In "Theon of Smyrna", mathematics useful for understanding Plato, Page 89, it reads: " Most of the stars are fixed; they are carried together by a unique and simple circular movement, with the first sphere which is the largest, as if they were fixed to it and as if they were moved by it. They always have the same relative position on the sphere, ( The inerratic sphere) and maintain the same order between each other and do not experience any change of form or movement, nor of size or color." The multiple spheres collectively, are called "heaven" and also carry the sun, moon and planets. Differential motions between the various spheres account for the different motions of the sun and moon. Also, they account for the retrograde motions of the planets around us. This is definitely a Geocentric system.

Also in "Theon Of Smyrna", Page 94, "The Myth of Pamphylion in Plato's Republic" is full of interesting information about the arrangement of the celestial bodies (Domes). " he says that an axis traverses the celestial pole like a pillar. He adds that there is another spine-like axis with hollow vertibra nested one next to the other. These vertebra are none other than the spheres (Domes) carrying the seven planets. The last sphere being that of the stars, envelopes all the others."

inerratic wrote:
Theon Of Smyrna
information about the arrangement of the celestial bodies

Theon of Smyrna is a HELIOcentric?

In the astronomy section of Expositio rerum mathematicarum, we are told by Theon of Smyrna, "that the Earth is spherical, that mountains are negligible in height compared with the Earth etc. It includes knowledge of conjunctions, eclipses, occultation and transits."

Thank you for your comments. It may be difficult for english speaking people to translate the greek from " Exposito rerum mathematicarum", so I have encluded this link: https://oniehlibraryofgreekliterature.files.wordpress.com/2015/09/129402670-theon-of-smyrna-mathematics-useful-for-understanding-plato.pdf
  I think if you reread my first two posts on page one of this thread, I explained what I believe happened to this and many other books by an interested party, in the past. The oldest globe, goes back to the 1490's and "Theon" was translated in 1979 from the 1892 Greek/French edition of J. Dupuis. On page 156 of this edition, it says: " This passage is altered and the manuscripts have a blank gap at the end." Isn't it possible that the copiers of the manuscripts altered parts to suit their purpose? How do rotating ball earth concepts, written alongside of a moving "inerratic sphere, covered with stars", appear in the same book?

inerratic wrote:
"Exposito rerum mathematicarum"
theon-of-smyrna

reread my first two posts on page one of this thread
I explained what happened to many other books by an interested party, in the past
The oldest globe, goes back to the 1490's
"Theon" was translated in 1979 from the 1892 Greek/French edition of J. Dupuis

How do rotating ball earth concepts, written alongside of a moving "inerratic sphere, covered with stars", appear in the same book?

I have to agree with you, after much reading my conclusion is the same as yours, it looks like the lying pen of the scribes have added the word "SPHERE", giving importance to the Heliocentric model, as something that came from the time of Plato.

Thanks "Schpankme" for the comments. Another interesting thing, that is just my opinion, is that the objects called "Libyan Glass" found in the Libyan desert, in a particular area, may actually be pieces of the dome. I have read that the silicon in them is purer than any silicon (Glass) made on earth. Aristotle mentions the domes are not made of matter, but he also says that there are different energies and physics applying to heaven. Is it possible, that the pieces of the domes, change when they fall to earth? That still leaves many questions.

inerratic wrote:
"Libyan Glass" found in the Libyan desert
may actually be pieces of the dome
the silicon in them is purer than any silicon made on earth

Aristotle mentions the domes are not made of matter
he says that there are different energies and physics applying to heaven

Is it possible
that the pieces of the domes
change when they fall to earth?

Libyan Desert Glass
"Between the towering dunes of the Eastern Great Sand Sea of Egypt are long narrow gaps where bedrock is exposed. It is in these areas of exposed surface that Libyan Desert Glass is found."

Glass normally turns yellow due to Sun exposure.

Aristotle
Isn't that interesting, Aristotle says, that the Heavens are "not made of matter"; this would rule out Dome made from glass.

Dome Spheres Oh My!
Are we now going from "Spheres" to "Domes"?

Quote Science Fiction Writer
I'm also very curious as to WHY you quote Richard Feynman, knowing that he was just another Science Fiction Writer?

Feynman Bio:
  developed mathematical expressions governing subatomic particles
  assisted in the development of the atomic bomb during World War II
  investigated the Space Shuttle Challenger disaster
  1999, the British journal, Physics World, ranked him as one of the ten greatest Theoretical Physicists (Science Fiction Writers) of all time.
  pioneering the field of quantum computing
  introducing the concept of nanotechnology
  He held the Richard C. Tolman professorship in Theoretical Physics at the California Institute of Technology.

Not worth an answer!

inerratic wrote:Not worth an answer!

This is my favorite part and your entire reason for being here:

"Is it possible
that the pieces of the domes
change when they fall to earth?"

Aristotle says that Domes are not made of Matter.

So will have them change to Glass when they Fall?
"Libyan Glass found in the Libyan desert"

Where do we find this Libyan Glass?
In a small section of the Eastern Sand Sea where the bedrock is exposed.

"Run for it Marty!  It's the Libyans." ~ Back to the Future

On another thread, I was asked "Can you please explain how this is a 'established source'? Referring to Aristotle and Plato. First of all, according to QZ.com, required reading of the top 200 Universities is Plato, Hobbes, Machiavelli and Aristotle. According to Webometrics.info, there are 26,355 universities world wide. I don't think we can discount them, as not being an "established source", because they are, "sold out to more recent governments", since Plato and Aristotle lived over 2,200 years ago. Thomas Taylor, the first English, translator of all the works of Plato, Aristotle and their commentators, has said "If Philosophy, properly so called be, according to Plato, and as I am firmly persuaded it is, the greatest good that was ever imparted by divinity to man, he who labors to rescue it from oblivion, and transmit it to posterity, must necessarily be endeavoring to benefit his country and all mankind, in the most eminent degree." Alfred North Whitehead, and Bertrand Russell were both attributed as saying: "All of western philosophy is merely a footnote to Plato."
I remember seeing the original painting called, " Pythagoras of Crotona", in Manly Hall's, museum at the "Philosophical Research Society", in Los Angeles, California. It was commissioned by Manly P. Hall in 1926, by J.A. Knapp, and found in Hall's book "The Secret Teachings of All Ages". Later, I came to the realization, that part of the modern connection of Pythagoras, with the ball earth, is from that modern painting, that shows a world globe, on the center right.
Pythagoras lived, in the range of 569-490 B.C.E. The first Globe was made by Crates of Mallus, in 150 B.C.E. and the first Terrestrial Globe was made by Martin Bahaim, in 1492. I think this shows that the globe in the painting was added by Knapp, due possibly, by his presumption of common knowledge of the time.
Euclid, was a Pythagorean, and I believe a contemporary of Plato's. How much is his "Elements of Geometry" used in every Geometry book available? If one studies,"The Theoretic Arithmetic of the Pythagoreans" he can see how much we have lost.

inerratic wrote:
Referring to Aristotle and Plato
required reading of the top 200 Universities
we can discount them, as an "established source", because they are
Plato and Aristotle lived over 2,200 years ago

Like your "Richard Feynman" quote you are completely disconnected from the reality you see around you; and pretend that others (UNIVERSITIES) could not possibly fool you.

Best Global Universities for Physics
These well-regarded universities from around the world have shown strength in producing research in a wide range of topics related to physics – the study of matter and energy. Topics include:

• particle and nuclear physics
  
• mathematical physics
  
• quantum physics
  
• theoretical physics
  

These are the Top Ten Global Universities for PRETEND:

• Massachusetts Institute of Technology
  
• University of California--Berkeley
  
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• University of Cambridge
  

On Nov. 22, 2016, I wrote:
"Excuse me, but I cannot find how, from the above post's how I "set about telling us how it is that "Aristotle" was not a freemason". I did however, think that it was widely known, that Aristotle lived from 384 BCE to 322 BCE and that the oldest document that make's reference to the Mason's is the Regius Poem, printed about 1390 AD. Therefore, I don't possibly see how Aristotle could be a Mason, do you? My purpose here is not to teach you everything about these Classics, but hopefully to generate some interest in these writings, and spurn those that are interested, into doing their own research into this most fascinating subject." Then, on Nov.23,2016 at 12:52 am, Schpankme wrote:
"My apologies, I meant to write the name of "Plato".
As always, the Dumb Profess it. You obviously did not understand that Aristotle was Plato's student, and then you tried to hide it by saying, "I meant to write Plato"
You can't stand Feynman's Quote because it is what you do. So you attack my use of Feynman, rather than speaking of what he said.
For the many others that have viewed this site,( over 1100), I do apologize, but he jumps in after being "nice" for awhile and then attacks, like Dr.Jekyll and Mr. Hyde.
He always loves to make lists, but rather than researching properly, he merely cuts and paste's what he finds on the internet in his lists. So here is a list for you:
  Obsessive-Compulsive Personality Disorder

• Preoccupation with orderliness, perfectionism, at the expense of flexibility, openness and efficiency.
  

• A person may be angry when service in a restaurant is poor, but instead of complaining to the management, the individual ruminates about how much to leave as a tip.
  

• Shows significant rigidity and stubbornness.
  

• They may display excessive deference to an authority they respect and excessive resistance to authority they do not respect.
  

      Get some help! I asked permission from administration before I started this thread and it was approved. Only they can dismiss my thread. No further communication is required.

inerratic wrote:
you attack my use of Feynman, rather than speaking of what he said

Feynman Bio:
 developed mathematical expressions governing subatomic particles (FAKE MATH)
 assisted in the development of the atomic bomb during World War II (FAKE NUKES)
 investigated the Space Shuttle Challenger disaster                             (FAKE SPACE)
 ranked as one of the ten greatest Theoretical Physicists of all time    (FAKE SCIENCE)
 pioneering the field of quantum computing                                          (FAKE SCIENCE)
 He held the Richard C. Tolman professorship in Theoretical Physics at the California Institute of Technology (PRETEND)

Do you comprehend Fact from Fiction, are we to believe that you're quoting one of the main Theoretical Priests (Feynman) of the last century, and you're not aware of this fact?

You claim that 200 Universities recommend reading Plato and Aristotle ("established source"), two men that no one can attest to them having actually lived; and each of these Universities sell Theoretical Physics as fact?

Lets cut to the chase, your whole reason for being here was to sell invisible magical Dome that fractures and falls to Earth, changing into Libyan Glass.

Based on the evidence presented you seem to be selling FICTION.

inerratic wrote:On Nov. 22, 2016, I wrote:
He always loves to make lists, but rather than researching properly, he merely cuts and paste's what he finds on the internet in his lists. So here is a list for you:
  Obsessive-Compulsive Personality Disorder
.

Your ad hominem attacks are not beneficial to this research forum.

'Wheel within a wheel', thought this was interesting, think of stars as the white balls

Schpankme wrote:

inerratic wrote:
Also the multitude of spheres are of different radius's.
In other places we will speak of the multitude of heavenly spheres.

There are No Spheres
There are No Spaceballs

Space, Spheres, and Spinning Balls were created to promote the Heliocentric Model; an ever expanding Universe of matter in a vacuum devoid of matter.

Just because the Earth isn't a sphere doesn't mean the firmament can't be a bubble... which is spherical.

vmartin wrote:

Schpankme wrote:

inerratic wrote:
Also the multitude of spheres are of different radius's.
In other places we will speak of the multitude of heavenly spheres.

There are No Spheres
There are No Spaceballs

Space, Spheres, and Spinning Balls were created to promote the Heliocentric Model; an ever expanding Universe of matter in a vacuum devoid of matter.

Just because the Earth isn't a sphere doesn't mean the firmament can't be a bubble... which is spherical.

prove the "firmament" is real

Russian Blue Cat wrote:

vmartin wrote:

Schpankme wrote:

inerratic wrote:
Also the multitude of spheres are of different radius's.
In other places we will speak of the multitude of heavenly spheres.

There are No Spheres
There are No Spaceballs

Space, Spheres, and Spinning Balls were created to promote the Heliocentric Model; an ever expanding Universe of matter in a vacuum devoid of matter.

Just because the Earth isn't a sphere doesn't mean the firmament can't be a bubble... which is spherical.

prove the "firmament" is real

Wow, how many angry shitposters are in this forum??

Being objective and straight to the point might come across "rude" to some people, but there needs to be no mixing of words. The majority of society believe this fake world we live in because they take "facts" as granted and not question or make people prove things. If you cannot directly experience something for yourself like "facts" "history" "scientific explanations" etc etc, you then must assume them as speculations, or lies until proven other wise.
The truth needs no defending, so let it take you to wherever it is, if you can let go of the ego that clings to being "right" it makes the navigation of this cesspit of lies much easier.

Omg, three cranks out of six posters... just in one thread!

Obviously I can't prove there's a firmament... That's a shitposter response.

And if were part of the "majority of society" I most likely wouldn't be here.

Why can't somebody have just respond honestly to the original poster with something like..

"Well innerratic, based on what I've read of Plato, Aristotle et al. I can safely say that when Plato/Arist. wrote such and such, they clearly meant they thought terra firma was spherical."

or probably more realistically

"Well innerratic, that's a valid question and given that I haven't read any Plato/ Aristotle I'm open to explore the possibility that the Greek may have been misquoted or mistranslated."

Cheers!