Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

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Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

Post by Thinkforyourself on Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:18 pm

Posted by thinkforyourself on 04/04/2015
This is a thread for a general discussion of ancient religious figures and myths. Anything can be discussed as long as it is about the origins of the ancient myths, and how they relate to actual people and possibly real events, like a great flood. 

My first question to those with knowledge in this area is: 'How far back are the origins of Hesus The Druid?' and 'Is there any evidence towards the fact that he could have been a real, physical person and not a parable?'

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Re: Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

Post by Thinkforyourself on Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:19 pm


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Re: Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

Post by Thinkforyourself on Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:19 pm

Posted by thinkforyourself on 04/04/2015

Apr 3, 2015 21:26:47 GMT schpankme said:
Suns of God
By Acharya S
[url=https://books.google.com/books?id=rey19p_ycHUC&pg=PA529&lpg=PA529&dq=hesus+Culdees&source=bl&ots=85DbEmalj-&sig=9aXsMih3fv0Y5d4JpNcpicaxBXU&hl=en&sa=X&ei=VQEfVYqmKY3hoATh0YCoBA&ved=0CCQQ6AEwAQ#v=onepage&q=hesus culdees&f=false]Please read from page 528 - 532; then when can have a mutual understanding and some basics to work from.[/url]




Thank you very much for the informative link. 

So, in other words, Hesus was the Druidic God, and not an actual person. Is that correct, or did they claim that the God Hesus ever appeared on Earth in person ? 

It is fascinating that so much of the imagery in the Bible already existed in Britain and Ireland so long before Jesus was meant to have lived, and it is obvious that they drew heavily on the Druid religion and culture when writing the Bible. 

Do you agree with the theory where it says that 'From the mountains of Britain proceeded the light which produced the wisdom of Egypt, Babylonia, Persia, India, Phoenicia, Judea and Greece? 

Why do you think that a people who seemed as learned as the Druids allowed the Phoenicians to influence them in such a negative way? 

Did the Druids have a Noah figure in their culture?

It seems likely that the whole planet had some form of universal set of religious and cultural beliefs at this time. Where do you think that this religion originated? Do you think that there was some form of world wide Government? 

Also, do you think that they had advanced technology, and if so, do you have any ideas how they created it? I assume that they did, because there seems to be evidence that they bonded rock, used laser cutting technology, moved huge rocks great distances, etc. 

Did the Druids meditate or use hallucinogenic drugs, such as magic mushrooms? 

Where do the Atlanteans come into this? Were they before all of these cultures? Could they have been the originators of the Hesus religion? 

Finally, where do the current New World Order fit into this? They seem to worship the sun, and the pyramids. Are they followers of the Druid religion. 

Sorry for asking so many questions. 

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Re: Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

Post by Thinkforyourself on Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:19 pm

Posted by Admin on 04/04/2015





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Re: Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

Post by Thinkforyourself on Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:20 pm

Posted by Admin on 04/04/2015


There is a reason that such things are "blasphemous" and "heretical" to fundamental Christianity because they expose the origins of the spiritual symbology that so many Christians take literally. If people are convinced Jesus was a historical personage I suggest they spend some time perusing the following articles/videos:

Astrotheology Part 1

Astrotheology Part 2

Astrotheology Part 3

Gnosticism, Gnostics, Gnosis and the Jesus Myth

Jesus Christ: Man or Myth?

The Bible's Hidden Meanings

Jesus Christ the Magic Mushroom Part 1

Jesus Christ the Magic Mushroom Part 2

Santa Claus the Magic Mushroom

Mushroom Mythologies

The Multi-Faceted Magic Mushroom

The Jewish God of the Old Testament is a Psychopath. Psychopaths are always looking for victim-minded co-dependent people who are easy to manipulate and turn into "faithful servants" as Jesus (good cop) and his Father (bad cop) have done with the Bible. Scare the shit out of everyone then promise them eternal heaven if they promise to shut off their critical faculties for the rest of their life. Just blindly believe in every word this big black book says and you'll have all the best things in life/afterlife and none of the terrible things we just scared you with. 

God just wants us to be Go-od, the D-evil wants us to be Evil, that's all. I guarantee God prefers good non-believers over evil believers any day. Not only that, but a God that gave us individuality, critical faculties and free will surely wants us to use those in determining our metaphysics instead of just having everyone parrot the same book allegedly dropped down from heaven (how many of these God-written books are there anyway?)

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Re: Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

Post by Thinkforyourself on Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:20 pm

Posted by thinkforyourself on 04/04/2015
Thanks for the reply and for posting all of these links. I will go through them. 

Do you have any opinions/answers regarding my other questions to Schpankme? 

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Re: Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

Post by Thinkforyourself on Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:21 pm

Posted by Admin on 04/04/2015
Hey, I think the Astrotheology and Magic Mushroom posts will help answer many of your questions. The ancient myths were all personifications of the divine force in nature, hence the same power within the Sun, the same magic within the mushrooms, is the same divine within us. These myths were well understood the world over thousands of years ago, but since their co-option have been literalized and historicized to the point that their allegorical/metaphorical meanings are completely lost on today's left-brained "religious" zealot zombies.

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Re: Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

Post by Thinkforyourself on Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:21 pm

Posted by richthofen on 04/04/2015

Apr 4, 2015 3:39:03 GMT Admin said:

If people are convinced Jesus was a historical personage I suggest they spend some time perusing the following articles/videos:





If even the Pharisees (the spiritual ancestors of those who call themselves "Jews" today) admit the historical personage of Jesus, that by itself should serve as convincing evidence that He did exist, or that at the least there is something to the stories. These Pharisees hate Jesus (and have since He walked the Earth), and their hatred for Him can be seen in their Talmud - where they claim that He is in hell etc. (they also have some vile explanations for his mother and virgin birth). If Jesus never existed, why the hatred and hostility? Even the Jews couldn't pretend it didn't happen, so they did the next best thing and tried to explain it away (e.g. He wasn't God - but was a magician, He didn't rise from the dead - His disciples stole the body, there was some sort of (Earthly) benefit for all His disciples who chose death rather than denying Him, etc.).

With the claim that the "God of the Old Testament is a Psychopath", I think you misunderstand the significance of sin. Death may seem to be a high price for eating the forbidden fruit, but God's laws are for the benefit of all. For a very basic example, paradise wouldn't be paradise if someone was allowed to go around murdering other people. Rebellion can have a very significant effect on everyone, not just the rebel, so God deals with it harshly (albeit justly).

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Re: Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

Post by Thinkforyourself on Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:21 pm

Posted by Admin on 04/04/2015
It's just a false dialectic and controlled opposition as usual Richtofen. The evil people of the world, the "satanists," hate Christ's, Mohammed's, Buddha's, Krishna's, and Moses' but "love" easily controllable Christians, Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus and Jews! The Gnostics, the original Christians left the orthodox church in Rome saying "they were setting up the fraud of historical Christianity" (meaning turning Christ into a real person). They said their Christ could never take human form. They believed in "Christ Consciousness" and the Kingdom of God within, those who develop this inner divinity become Christ-like or "Christian." Nowadays, however, being "Christian" means this:



Constantine (and others) co-opted the ancient sun-god-mushroom-man mythologies from the pre-Christian savior gods and created the ultimate state sponsored god-man Jesus Christ. Initially the apologists admitted he was an amalgamation of other ancient myths:

“When we say that he, Jesus Christ, our teacher, was produced without sexual union, was crucified and died, and rose again, and ascended into heaven, we propound nothing different from what you believe regarding the sons of Jupiter.” -Justin Martyr, “The First Apology of Justin”

Entire volumes have been written by Christians comparing Christianity with other Pagan religions. Here Justin Martyr admits the metaphorical (not literal) story of Jesus Christ is precisely analogous to pre-existing beliefs regarding Jupiter.

“And if we even affirm that He was born of a virgin, accept this in common with what you accept of Perseus. And in that we say that He made whole the lame, the paralytic, and those born blind, we seem to say what is very similar to the deeds said to have been done by Aesculapius.” -Justin Martyr, “The First Apology of Justin”

Through the course of the book, Justin Martyr admits that Jesus is analogous to the sons of Jupiter, Mercury, Aesculapius, Bacchus, Hercules, Dioscuri, Perseus, and Bellerophon. He admits their immaculate conceptions, miracles, untimely deaths, and ascents into heaven as symbolically purporting the same thing. He also admits Christianity teaches the same things as poets and philosophers citing Plato, Menander, Sibyl, Hystaspes, and Stoics. Since its inception Christianity never claimed to be historical, biographical, or even original.

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Re: Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

Post by Thinkforyourself on Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:22 pm

Posted by honesttruthseeker on 04/05/2015
I am sorry that you guys are bashing Christianity like this. And I am especially disappointed in Eric, I really taught he is, like me, an honest truth seeker.

Eric, I just went to your blog here Astrotheology (part 1) and read. You quote David Icke: "OK, a little quiz. Who am I talking about? He was born to a virgin by immaculate conception through the intervention of a holy spirit. This fulfilled an ancient prophecy. When he was born the ruling tyrant wanted to kill him. His parents had to flee to safety. All male children under the age of two were slain by the ruler as he sought to kill the child. Angels and shepherds were at his birth and he was given gifts of gold, frankincense and myrrh. He was worshipped as the savior of men and led a moral and humble life. He performed miracles which included healing the sick, giving sight to the blind, casting out devils and raising the dead. He was put to death on the cross between two thieves. He descended to hell and rose from the dead to ascend back to heaven. Sounds exactly like Jesus doesn’t it? But it’s not. That is how they described the Eastern savior god known as Virishna 1,200 years before Jesus is claimed to have been born.” -David Icke, “The Biggest Secret” (89)

Can you tell me, apart from David Icke, where can I read about this Virishna ?? A source, anything? Manuscripts? Drawings ? Anything? 

This "Eastern saviour god" Virishna only exists in the imagination of David Icke and other people. Not only he does not even exists, but you claim he was basically identical to Jesus
. Why the lie? 

Later you go and quote from Justin the Martyr. Very good. But why you take out of context??? Not only you took it out of context, but you said Justin actually admitted the metaphoricalstory of Jesus, which is not true!!

This is what Justin the Martyr was really saying, when one is reading read without taking out of context:

"
And that this may now become evident to you--(firstly) that whatever we assert in conformity with what has been taught us by Christ, and by the prophets who preceded Him, are alone true, and are older than all the writers who have existedthat we claim to be acknowledged, not because we say the same things as these writers said, but because we say true things: and (secondly) that Jesus Christ is the only proper Son who has been begotten by God, being His Word and first-begotten, and power; and, becoming man according to His will, He taught us these things for the conversion and restoration of the human race: and (thirdly) that before He became a man among men, some, influenced by the demons before mentioned, related beforehand, through the instrumentality of the poets, those circumstances as having really happened, which, having fictitiously devised, they narrated, in the same manner as they have caused to be fabricated the scandalous reports against us of infamous and impious actions, of which there is neither witness nor proof--we shall bring forward the following proof."

I hope these were just mistakes, otherwise I will be very sad to find out that you are really on against Christianity. 

I like this forum, and love finding out about our flat earth.


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Re: Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

Post by Thinkforyourself on Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:23 pm

Posted by thinkforyourself on 04/05/2015

Apr 4, 2015 15:07:21 GMT honesttruthseeker said:
I am sorry that you guys are bashing Christianity like this. And I am especially disappointed in Eric, I really taught he is, like me, an honest truth seeker.








What about the Druid Hesus then? What about Horus? Attis? Krishna? Mithra? Dionysus? 

All of these figures were obviously the inspiration for Jesus Christ, or Hesus Krishna, or are you saying that they are all false as well? 

Remember, just like with the Flat Earth, what matters is the truth, even if it hurts to admit it.  

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Re: Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

Post by Thinkforyourself on Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:24 pm

Posted by Admin on 04/05/2015
I did not take Justin Martyr out of context, this is exactly the meaning and purpose of the early Christian "apologists." They were the establishment's minions convincing the Roman masses to accept their new amalgamated god-man, Jesus Christ, who shared all the same traits and characteristics of all the other pagan gods people were worshiping at the time. There are 16 crucified saviors that shared nearly identical stories to Jesus Christ long before his supposed life including Krishna, the 8th incarnation of Vishnu or Virishna

Specific Similarities Between the Lives of Krishna and Christ





















“‘Mises’ is found in Syria, where he was pulled out of a basket floating in a river. Mises also had tablets of stone upon which laws were written, and a rod with which he did miracles, including parting waters and leading his army across the sea. In addition, ‘Manes the lawgiver’ took the stage in Egypt, and ‘Minos’ was the Cretan reformer. Jacolliot traces the original Moses to the Indian Manou: ‘This name of Manou, or Manes . . . is not a substantive, applying to an individual man; its Sanskrit signification is the man, par excellence, the legislator. It is a title aspired to by all the leaders of men in antiquity.’” -Acharya S., “The Christ Conspiracy” (169)

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Re: Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

Post by Thinkforyourself on Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:24 pm

Posted by lizardking on 04/05/2015
Jesus is not the only figure that has been heavily plagiarised from earlier religions.

"The Noah flood myth from the Bible was also attributed to Zisudra and Atrahasis in Sumerian/Mesopotamian culture. In Aztec mythology only Coxcoxtli and his wife Xochiquetzal were forewarned of the flood by God and survived by building a huge boat. They wandered for 104 years before landing in “Antlan.” The Mechoacanesecs of Central America say Tezpi built a large boat, loaded it with animals, grains, seeds, and escaped the flood with his wife and children. The Maya say “the great mother and great father” survived and repopulated the world after the flood. The Chickasaw native Americans say only one family and two animals of every kind were saved from the flood. The same basic story is found in almost 600 cultures around the world. “From almost every culture around the world there emerge more than five hundred strikingly similar legends of a great Flood? These legends all share a common theme - of mankind being swept away with the exception of one man and his family who survived. We in the West generally know the survivor’s name as Noah, but to the Aztecs he was Nene, whilst in the Near East he was Atra-Hasis, Utnapishtim or Ziusudra. As for his means of escape, the Bible describes an ‘ark’ or boat, Mesopotamian records describe a submersible vessel, and the Aztec version refers to a hollowed-out log. According to the Aztec legend, men were saved by turning into fish. Ancient texts from the Near East speak of the Flood as a major catastrophe - not a local or trivial event, but a great time divider.” -Alan F. Alford, “Gods of the New Millennium – The Shattering Truth of Human Origins” ~ www.atlanteanconspiracy.com/2008/07/atlantis-and-deluge.html

If you want to prove a historical 2000 year old Jesus existed, please find us one pagan historical document from that time period speaking of him.

"Here's what another scholar, GRS Mead, wrote: It has always been an unfailing source of astonishment to the historical investigator of Christian beginnings that there is not a single word from the pen of any pagan writer of the first century of our era which can in any fashion be referred to the marvelous story recounted by the Gospel writers. The very existence of Jesus seems unknown." 

"Mediocre apologists who've read the ever-popular Josh McDowell books are fond of touting historical evidence for Jesus. Don't let them get away with it. This "evidence" always turns out to be non-contemporaneous, as in Tacitus's 2nd century reference to Christians (which does nothing to prove that there was an actual Christ), and especially Josephus, who not only was born after the putative time of Christ, but whose purported mention of him has been determined by scholars-- not pious apologists-- to be an interpolation. The arguments in defense of this are overly technical for an impromptu oral argument." ~ www.deism.com/jesusexist.htm

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Re: Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

Post by Thinkforyourself on Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:25 pm

Posted by Admin on 04/05/2015
Apr 4, 2015 15:07:21 GMT honesttruthseeker said:
I am sorry that you guys are bashing Christianity like this. And I am especially disappointed in Eric, I really taught he is, like me, an honest truth seeker.

I am an honest truth seeker and I'm not "bashing" Christianity. I'm exposing the truth about several mythological religions long before Christianity which bring into serious question the validity of the Jesus Christ story referencing a literal, historical person. 














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Re: Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

Post by Thinkforyourself on Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:26 pm

Posted by honesttruthseeker on 04/05/2015
 Yes, you did take Justin the Martyr out of context. I explicitly showed you what he actually meant in the letter you extracted those paragraphs from.

You claim "this is exactly the meaning and purpose of the early Christian "apologists.". Fair enough. Anything to back up this claim?

I am still waiting for proof of manuscripts/statues/drawings/anything to prove Virishna actually existed, let alone he had the life you claim he had.

To thinkforyourself: 

Have you actually researched for yourself these alleged comparisons between Jesus and the other "gods"? Because I have. There is no comparison. They are superficial at best, very generalized, some completely not true. For some of the other "deities" you mention, the only sources are a few drawings (ie ESUS or Mithra), some are completely invented (ie Virishna by David Icke) and others comparisons are very stretched.
WIKIPEDIA: 

ESUS or HESUS

Written sources[edit]

A well-known section in Lucan's Bellum civile talks about the gory sacrifices offered to a triad of Celtic deities: Teutates, Hesus (an aspirated form of Esus), and Taranis.[1] Among a pair of later commentators on Lucan's work, one identifies Teutates with Mercury and Esus with Mars. According to the Berne Commentary on Lucan, human victims were sacrificed to Esus by being tied to a tree and flailed.[2]



The Gallic medical writer Marcellus of Bordeaux may offer another textual reference to Esus in his De medicamentis, a compendium of pharmacological preparations written in Latin in the early 5th century and the sole source for several Celtic words. The work contains a magico-medical charm decipherable as Gaulish which appears to invoke the aid of Esus (spelled Aisus) in curing throat trouble.[3]



The given name "Esunertus" ("strength of Esus") occurs at least once as an epithet of Mercury on a dedicatory inscription.[4][5] It is possible that the Esuvii of Gaul, in the area of present-day Normandy, took their name from this deity.[6]

HORUS

Horus was born to the goddess Isis after she retrieved all the dismembered body parts of her murdered husband Osiris, except his penis which was thrown into the Nile and eaten by a catfish,[7][8] or sometimes by a crab, and according to Plutarch's account (see Osiris) used her magic powers to resurrect Osiris and fashion a golden phallus[9] to conceive her son (older Egyptian accounts have the penis of Osiris surviving).



Once Isis knew she was pregnant with Horus, she fled to the Nile Delta marshlands to hide from her brother Set who jealously killed Osiris and who she knew would want to kill their son.[10] There Isis bore a divine son, Horus.

ATTIS

An Attis cult began around 1250 BC in Dindymon (today's Murat Dağı of Gediz, Kütahya). He was originally a local semi-deity of Phrygia, associated with the great Phrygian trading city of Pessinos, which lay under the lee of Mount Agdistis. The mountain was personified as a daemon, whom foreigners associated with the Great Mother Cybele.



In the late 4th century BC, a cult of Attis became a feature of the Greek world. The story of his origins at Agdistis, recorded by the traveler Pausanias, have some distinctly non-Greek elements: Pausanias was told that the daemon Agdistis initially bore both male and female attributes. But the Olympian gods, fearing Agdistis, cut off the male organ and cast it away. There grew up from it an almond-tree, and when its fruit was ripe, Nana, who was a daughter of the river-god Sangarius, picked an almond and laid it in her bosom. The almond disappeared, and she became pregnant. Nana abandoned the baby (Attis). The infant was tended by a he-goat. As Attis grew, his long-haired beauty was godlike, and Agdistis as Cybele then fell in love with him. But the foster parents of Attis sent him to Pessinos, where he was to wed the king's daughter. According to some versions the King of Pessinos was Midas. Just as the marriage-song was being sung, Agdistis/Cybele appeared in her transcendent power, and Attis went mad and cut off his genitals. Attis' father-in-law-to-be, the king who was giving his daughter in marriage, followed suit, prefiguring the self-castrating corybantes who devoted themselves to Cybele. But Agdistis repented and saw to it that the body of Attis should neither rot at all nor decay.[6]



Krishna

Krishna is often described and portrayed as an infant eating butter, a young boy playing a flute as in the Bhagavata Purana,[2] or as an elder giving direction and guidance as in the Bhagavad Gita.[3] The stories of Krishna appear across a broad spectrum of Hindu philosophical and theological traditions.[4] They portray him in various perspectives: a god-child, a prankster, a model lover, a divine hero, and the Supreme Being.[5] The principal scriptures discussing Krishna's story are the Mahabharata, the Harivamsa, the Bhagavata Purana, and the Vishnu Purana.

Mithra

Mithra  is the Zoroastrian angelic Divinity (yazata) of Covenant and Oath. In addition to being the Divinity of Contracts, Mithra is also a judicial figure, an all-seeing Protector of Truth, and the Guardian of Cattle, the Harvest and of The Waters.

Much about the cult of Mithras is only known from reliefs and sculptures. There have been many attempts to interpret this material.



Mithras-worship in the Roman Empire was characterized by images of the god slaughtering a bull. Other images of Mithras are found in the Roman temples, for instance Mithras banqueting with Sol, and depictions of the birth of Mithras from a rock. But the image of bull-slaying (tauroctony) is always in the central niche.[28] Textual sources for a reconstruction of the theology behind this iconography are very rare.[29] (See section Interpretations of the bull-slaying scene below.)



The practice of depicting the god slaying a bull seems to be specific to Roman Mithraism. According to David Ulansey, this is "perhaps the most important example" of evident difference between Iranian and Roman traditions: "... there is no evidence that the Iranian god Mithra ever had anything to do with killing a bull."[30]

Dionysus

The earliest discussions of mythological parallels between Dionysus and the figure of the Christ in Christian theology can be traced to Friedrich Hölderlin, whose identification of Dionysus with Christ is most explicit in Brod und Wein (1800–1801) and Der Einzige (1801–1803).[59]



Theories regarding such parallels were popular in the 19th century but were later on mostly rejected by contemporary scholarship. A few modern scholars such as Martin Hengel, Barry Powell, Robert M. Price, and Peter Wick, among others, argue that Dionysian religion and Christianity have notable parallels. They point to the symbolism of wine and the importance it held in the mythology surrounding both Dionysus and Jesus Christ;[60][61] though, Wick argues that the use of wine symbolism in the Gospel of John, including the story of the Marriage at Cana at which Jesus turns water into wine, was intended to show Jesus as superior to Dionysus.[62]



A few scholars of comparative mythology identify both Dionysus and Jesus with the dying-and-returning god mythological archetype.[12] However, this identification is often seen as superficial as most such deities had a cyclical nature, as they died and were reborn each year, representing the cycle of nature, while the resurrection of Christ was a single event placed in a specific historical and geographical context. On the other hand, Dionysus life-death-rebirth cycle was strongly tied to the grape harvest. Moreover it has been noted that the details of Dionysus death and rebirth are starkly different both in content and symbolism from Jesus, with Dionysus being (in the most common myth) torn to pieces and eaten by the titans and "eventually restored to a new life" from the heart that was left over.[63][64] Other elements, such as the celebration by a ritual meal of bread and wine, also have parallels.[65] Powell, in particular, argues precursors to the Catholic notion of transubstantiation can be found in Dionysian religion.[65] However such claims are strongly disputed as the rituals of Dionysus did not involve the transformation of the substance of bread and wine in the god himself. Rather the myth stated that Dionysus became the wine of libation, which was not drunk or consumed in any way, hence having a very different symbolism.



Another parallel can be seen in The Bacchae where Dionysus appears before King Pentheus on charges of claiming divinity which is compared to the New Testament scene of Jesus being interrogated by Pontius Pilate.[62][65][66] However several scholars dispute this parallel, since while Jesus, during the trial before Pilate, did not affirm openly he was a god nor asked for any honor, Dionysus was arrested by Pentheus after making the women of Thebes mad and complaining about the fact that the city of Thebes, and its king, have refused to honor him. Moreoever, the confrontation of Dionysus and Pentheus also ends with Pentheus dying, torn into pieces by the mad women, including his mother. The details of the story, including its resolution, make the Dionysus story radically different than the one of Jesus, except for the parallel of the arrest, which is a detail that appears in many biographies as well.[67]



Most modern biblical scholars and historians today, both conservative and liberal, reject most of the parallelomania between the cult of Dionysus and Christ, asserting that the similarities are superficial at best, most often vaguely general and universal parallels found in many stories, both historical and mythical, and that the symbolism represented by the similar themes are radically different.[64][68][69][70]

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Re: Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

Post by Thinkforyourself on Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:27 pm

Posted by Admin on 04/05/2015

Apr 4, 2015 15:56:30 GMT honesttruthseeker said:
 Yes, you did take Justin the Martyr out of context. I explicitly showed you what he actually meant in the letter you extracted those paragraphs from.

You claim "this is exactly the meaning and purpose of the early Christian "apologists.". Fair enough. Anything to back up this claim?

I am still waiting for proof of manuscripts/statues/drawings/anything to prove Virishna actually existed, let alone he had the life you claim he had.




No, you're taking Christ out of context, I'm not taking Justin Martyr out of context, I've read the entire first apology. You say you're "still waiting for proof Virishna actually existed," but I've told you none of these "god-men" existed. They're all myths. How about YOU provide evidence that even though 16 other religions were based around characters with similar "miracles" and life stories, that the 17th Christ one was the real one, and he actually existed. I've researched all the supposed "historical evidence" for Jesus' existence and what little they point to has been thoroughly debunked and not enough to constitute proof regardless.






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Re: Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

Post by Thinkforyourself on Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:27 pm

Posted by honesttruthseeker on 04/05/2015

Apr 4, 2015 16:09:07 GMT Admin said:
Apr 4, 2015 15:56:30 GMT honesttruthseeker said:
 Yes, you did take Justin the Martyr out of context. I explicitly showed you what he actually meant in the letter you extracted those paragraphs from.

You claim "this is exactly the meaning and purpose of the early Christian "apologists.". Fair enough. Anything to back up this claim?

I am still waiting for proof of manuscripts/statues/drawings/anything to prove Virishna actually existed, let alone he had the life you claim he had.


No, you're taking Christ out of context, I'm not taking Justin Martyr out of context, I've read the entire first apology. You say you're "still waiting for proof Virishna actually existed," but I've told you none of these "god-men" existed. They're all myths. How about YOU provide evidence that even though 16 other religions were based around characters with similar "miracles" and life stories, that the 17th Christ one was the real one, and he actually existed. I've researched all the supposed "historical evidence" for Jesus' existence and what little they point to has been thoroughly debunked and not enough to constitute proof regardless.





I see you are dodging my question...I am waiting for proof of Virishna myth exists. In what manuscript/document do we find about this Virishna, apart from David Icke and maybe one more author???   For instance, for Mithra we have a few drawings, for Dionysus we have a few drawings and sculptures...you get the point.

I have shown you evidence...evidence that can easily be verified by just going on Wikipedia and reading about these "deities" that they have nothing in common with Jesus.


See...when you claim all these "deities"/"gods" share stories similar with Jesus, you have to show me the proof. And I am not talking about Writers like Archarya S or David Icke....I expect a drawing/manuscript/something that can be verified where I should find these myths.

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Re: Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

Post by Thinkforyourself on Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:27 pm

Posted by Admin on 04/05/2015
I already provided you with a link showing Virishna/Vishnu to be the same with different spellings, and his 8th avatar Krishna was analogous to Christ. You clearly didn't read any of my articles or watch any of the videos which contain the proof you're claiming to want but are unwilling to receive. 





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Re: Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

Post by Thinkforyourself on Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:28 pm

Posted by lizardking on 04/05/2015
This is a great video thanks!

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Re: Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

Post by Thinkforyourself on Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:29 pm

Posted by Admin on 04/05/2015
Glad you like that one LizardKing, the Hitchins one isn't quite as good (forgive the hysterical women part), but I'm just trying to show several sources. Here's another:





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Re: Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

Post by Thinkforyourself on Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:30 pm

Posted by thinkforyourself on 04/05/2015

Apr 4, 2015 16:19:12 GMT honesttruthseeker said:
Apr 4, 2015 16:09:07 GMT Admin said:
No, you're taking Christ out of context, I'm not taking Justin Martyr out of context, I've read the entire first apology. You say you're "still waiting for proof Virishna actually existed," but I've told you none of these "god-men" existed. They're all myths. How about YOU provide evidence that even though 16 other religions were based around characters with similar "miracles" and life stories, that the 17th Christ one was the real one, and he actually existed. I've researched all the supposed "historical evidence" for Jesus' existence and what little they point to has been thoroughly debunked and not enough to constitute proof regardless.




I see you are dodging my question...I am waiting for proof of Virishna myth exists. In what manuscript/document do we find about this Virishna, apart from David Icke and maybe one more author???   For instance, for Mithra we have a few drawings, for Dionysus we have a few drawings and sculptures...you get the point.

I have shown you evidence...evidence that can easily be verified by just going on Wikipedia and reading about these "deities" that they have nothing in common with Jesus.


See...when you claim all these "deities"/"gods" share stories similar with Jesus, you have to show me the proof. And I am not talking about Writers like Archarya S or David Icke....I expect a drawing/manuscript/something that can be verified where I should find these myths.



I started this thread, because I have a genuine interest in the origins of religion and in spirituality. Eric, Lizardking and Schpankme have all posted interesting pieces of information for me to interpret, whereas you have admitted that you are getting your information from Wikipedia. 

Nothing that you posted above answered my questions. You simply posted mini-biographies of certain religious figures, without any mention of how they were different to Christ, with the exception of your part about Dionysus. That part at least compared the two, but had no real convincing evidence to show that they are not just part of the same mythological figure. In fact, I personally think that the comparisons only went to show how similar they are. 

Please do not derail this thread with 'evidence' from Wikipedia. If you are going to comment here again, I would like to see more actual evidence, and not just from an untrustworthy, easy to edit website like Wikipedia. 

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Re: Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

Post by Thinkforyourself on Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:30 pm

Posted by schpankme on 04/05/2015
The correct reference should be to Vishnu, who represents one of the three (trinity) principal denominations of Hinduism.
Vishnu is generally considered to be God, while Krishna is considered his incarnation. Should we say the SUN/SON of God?  You could argue this point till your blue in the face!

The letter  " J "  wasn't in use till about the 12th century, could you provide the name of "Jesus Christ" before that period?

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Re: Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

Post by Thinkforyourself on Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:31 pm

Posted by Admin on 04/05/2015
D. M. Murdock (Acharya S) is another good scholar/source on the subject:





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Re: Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

Post by Thinkforyourself on Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:32 pm

Posted by honesttruthseeker on 04/05/2015
Excuse me for having Wikipedia as evidence....which is based on actual historical manuscripts/drawings.

Am I supposed to believe everything David Icke or Archarya S or any other writer is saying? Even if what they are saying cannot be backed up on historical documents?

I do not accuse Eric of anything, but he was dodging the question and his final answer was that Virishna was actually Vishnu/Krishna. Now where in Vishnu/Krishna's history/myths do we find the following, story which is attributed to Virishna ??
He was born to a virgin by immaculate conception through the intervention of a holy spirit. This fulfilled an ancient prophecy. When he was born the ruling tyrant wanted to kill him. His parents had to flee to safety. All male children under the age of two were slain by the ruler as he sought to kill the child. Angels and shepherds were at his birth and he was given gifts of gold, frankincense and myrrh. He was worshipped as the savior of men and led a moral and humble life. He performed miracles which included healing the sick, giving sight to the blind, casting out devils and raising the dead. He was put to death on the cross between two thieves. He descended to hell and rose from the dead to ascend back to heaven. Sounds exactly like Jesus doesn’t it? But it’s not. That is how they described the Eastern savior god known as Virishna 1,200 years before Jesus is claimed to have been born.”

Now, in the paragraph you have shown me, the only similarity between the two is that Dionysus was the god of grape harvest and Jesus turned water into wine once. Everyone believes what he wants out of this but it will only be speculation.

Jesus was mentioned by writers, but because these writers have become christians, now people is expected to find pagan sources, because christian writers are liars and forgers so they are not trustworthy.

You know, there are over 5000 manuscripts of the new testament alone and people still think Jesus never existed. While for these other deities you guys mention, the documents/manuscripts/drawings depicting them are laughable.

You know what, you guys believe what you want, everyone is free to think what they want.


For the moment I am going to focus on the flat earth proofs and leave this debate.

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Re: Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

Post by Thinkforyourself on Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:32 pm

Posted by lizardking on 04/05/2015
Where was the first mention of a literal or metaphysical being who we would regard as a Devil or Lucifer? Did this originate in Atlantis, for instance?

Also, does anyone think there genuinely was a giant flood that altered the shape of our continents? There are ancient cities underwater and riverbeds at the bottom of oceans suggesting that there potentially was.

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Re: Hesus Krishna/General Ancient Religious Figures and Myths

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